Supporting TOR: Seeking Affordable and Reliable Server Providers in Eastern Europe
Hello everyone, I’ve been a fan of Tor for many years now, and my affinity for anonymity naturally extends to other interests, such as Monero… 😉 I’ve successfully rallied like-minded individuals who have generously supported our cause through various grants, and we’ve even received a government subsidy from the Czech Republic to promote freedom of speech in oppressive regimes. With a substantial sum of money at our disposal, we’ve chosen to allocate a portion to support the TOR project. Currently, we operate around 60 servers. Our main challenge, unsurprisingly, is with exit servers. Convincing providers to overlook automatic complaint notifications has proven quite tricky. From our original 30 exit nodes, we’re down to about 5—the rest had to be shifted to relay nodes. We could switch them to well-known operators like RDP.sh, but they already host a large number of exit nodes, and we prefer to encourage network diversity. We’ve initiated something akin to a cost-sharing model for enabling our servers to run exit nodes, but it hasn’t made a significant impact. We want to spend our funds wisely to support Tor. Do any of you have suggestions for good, affordable providers in less conventional locations (e.g., Eastern Europe like Poland, Hungary, Ukraine)? Thanks for any ideas, Alex https://tor.foundation
Hello Alex, Welcome to the Tor relays community. On Sat, Aug 31, 2024 at 11:48:51AM +0300, Alex Swabbie via tor-relays wrote:
Hello everyone,
I’ve been a fan of Tor for many years now, and my affinity for anonymity naturally extends to other interests, such as Monero… 😉
I’ve successfully rallied like-minded individuals who have generously supported our cause through various grants, and we’ve even received a government subsidy from the Czech Republic to promote freedom of speech in oppressive regimes.
Regarding the government subsidy from the Czech Republic that you mentioned, could you please provide more details and any relevant links? Transparency is crucial for building a trusted community, and this information would be beneficial for everyone.
With a substantial sum of money at our disposal, we’ve chosen to allocate a portion to support the TOR project. Currently, we operate around 60 servers. Our main challenge, unsurprisingly, is with exit servers. Convincing providers to overlook automatic complaint notifications has proven quite tricky. From our original 30 exit nodes, we’re down to about 5—the rest had to be shifted to relay nodes. We could switch them to well-known operators like RDP.sh, but they already host a large number of exit nodes, and we prefer to encourage network diversity.
We’ve initiated something akin to a cost-sharing model for enabling our servers to run exit nodes, but it hasn’t made a significant impact.
I also wanted to share that we're currently discussing a new policy for the Tor relay community focused on incentivization models. You can check it out here: https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/community/policies/-/issues/22
We want to spend our funds wisely to support Tor. Do any of you have suggestions for good, affordable providers in less conventional locations (e.g., Eastern Europe like Poland, Hungary, Ukraine)?
Thanks for any ideas,
Lastly, I noticed that your domain name includes "Tor". Please be aware that we request you avoid using "Tor" in your product or domain name to prevent any potential confusion. Our goal is to ensure that people clearly understand what is officially associated with The Tor Project and what is not. From our Trademark FAQ: Q: Can I use the word "Tor" as part of the name of my product or my domain name? A: Please don't use Tor in your product name or domain name. Instead, find a name that will accurately identify your products or services. Remember that our goal is to make sure that people aren't confused about whether your product or project is made or endorsed by The Tor Project. Creating a new brand that incorporates the Tor brand is likely to lead to confusion, and commercial confusion is a sign of trademark infringement. https://www.torproject.org/about/trademark/#trademark-faq-3 Best, Gus -- The Tor Project Community Team Lead
On Montag, 2. September 2024 14:54:55 CEST gus wrote: Hello Alex, First of all, it's nice that you're on the list. Maybe you would like to listen in on the meeting on Saturday. (It's anonymous and without a webcam) https://lists.torproject.org/pipermail/tor-relays/2024-August/021814.html I had already added your foundation in the pad ;-)
On Sat, Aug 31, 2024 at 11:48:51AM +0300, Alex Swabbie via tor-relays wrote:
Hello everyone,
I’ve been a fan of Tor for many years now, and my affinity for anonymity naturally extends to other interests, such as Monero… 😉 OT: Do you already know the new DEX? https://haveno-reto.com/
I’ve successfully rallied like-minded individuals who have generously supported our cause through various grants, and we’ve even received a government subsidy from the Czech Republic to promote freedom of speech in oppressive regimes. Regarding the government subsidy from the Czech Republic that you mentioned, could you please provide more details and any relevant links? Transparency is crucial for building a trusted community, and this information would be beneficial for everyone.
With a substantial sum of money at our disposal, we’ve chosen to allocate a portion to support the TOR project. Currently, we operate around 60 servers. Our main challenge, unsurprisingly, is with exit servers. Convincing providers to overlook automatic complaint notifications has proven quite tricky. From our original 30 exit nodes, we’re down to about 5—the rest had to be shifted to relay nodes. We could switch them to well-known operators like RDP.sh, but they already host a large number of exit nodes, and we prefer to encourage network diversity.
We’ve initiated something akin to a cost-sharing model for enabling our servers to run exit nodes, but it hasn’t made a significant impact.
Unfortunately, it is difficult to find a provider for exits. Where it is allowed, there are usually many others. The best option is your own AS. Unfortunately, you need a whole /24 for that. An alternative would be, for example, a /27 subnet with a shared whois (SWIP) entry. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shared_Whois_Project If you have the abuse entry for your IPs, then you can operate your tor-exit pretty worry-free. Since you're talking about government subsidy, maybe it's possible for the government or provider to lend you IP space. If you can get IPs somewhere, ask on this list for a LIR who can register them for you with RIPE. Once you have an AS, you can operate your own servers. A cheap colocation provider is, for example: https://serverius.net/colocation/server-colocation/ An offer for 1/8 rack + 1 x /29 IPv4 network and /64 IPv6 network: https://www.myloc.de/en/colocation/colocation-offer.html (For me, 40 relays generate several terabytes per day, and several petabytes per month.)
I also wanted to share that we're currently discussing a new policy for the Tor relay community focused on incentivization models. You can check it out here: https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/community/policies/-/issues/22
We want to spend our funds wisely to support Tor. Do any of you have suggestions for good, affordable providers in less conventional locations (e.g., Eastern Europe like Poland, Hungary, Ukraine)?
You can inquire about IP subnets and dedicated servers at https://lowendtalk.com List of SirNeo: https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/185210/tor-relay-bridge https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/186269/cheap-hosters-that-allow-tor-exit-n...
Lastly, I noticed that your domain name includes "Tor". Please be aware that we request you avoid using "Tor" in your product or domain name to prevent any potential confusion. Our goal is to ensure that people clearly understand what is officially associated with The Tor Project and what is not.
From our Trademark FAQ:
Q: Can I use the word "Tor" as part of the name of my product or my domain name?
A: Please don't use Tor in your product name or domain name. Instead, find a name that will accurately identify your products or services. Remember that our goal is to make sure that people aren't confused about whether your product or project is made or endorsed by The Tor Project. Creating a new brand that incorporates the Tor brand is likely to lead to confusion, and commercial confusion is a sign of trademark infringement.
Just as a note: Many others have used the word onion in a local language for foundation and domain. -- ╰_╯ Ciao Marco! Debian GNU/Linux It's free software and it gives you freedom!
Hello Alex, I wanted to follow up and check if you had a moment to answer my email. Gus On Mon, Sep 02, 2024 at 09:55:04AM -0300, gus wrote:
Hello Alex,
Welcome to the Tor relays community.
On Sat, Aug 31, 2024 at 11:48:51AM +0300, Alex Swabbie via tor-relays wrote:
Hello everyone,
I’ve been a fan of Tor for many years now, and my affinity for anonymity naturally extends to other interests, such as Monero… 😉
I’ve successfully rallied like-minded individuals who have generously supported our cause through various grants, and we’ve even received a government subsidy from the Czech Republic to promote freedom of speech in oppressive regimes.
Regarding the government subsidy from the Czech Republic that you mentioned, could you please provide more details and any relevant links? Transparency is crucial for building a trusted community, and this information would be beneficial for everyone.
With a substantial sum of money at our disposal, we’ve chosen to allocate a portion to support the TOR project. Currently, we operate around 60 servers. Our main challenge, unsurprisingly, is with exit servers. Convincing providers to overlook automatic complaint notifications has proven quite tricky. From our original 30 exit nodes, we’re down to about 5—the rest had to be shifted to relay nodes. We could switch them to well-known operators like RDP.sh, but they already host a large number of exit nodes, and we prefer to encourage network diversity.
We’ve initiated something akin to a cost-sharing model for enabling our servers to run exit nodes, but it hasn’t made a significant impact.
I also wanted to share that we're currently discussing a new policy for the Tor relay community focused on incentivization models. You can check it out here: https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/community/policies/-/issues/22
We want to spend our funds wisely to support Tor. Do any of you have suggestions for good, affordable providers in less conventional locations (e.g., Eastern Europe like Poland, Hungary, Ukraine)?
Thanks for any ideas,
Lastly, I noticed that your domain name includes "Tor". Please be aware that we request you avoid using "Tor" in your product or domain name to prevent any potential confusion. Our goal is to ensure that people clearly understand what is officially associated with The Tor Project and what is not.
From our Trademark FAQ:
Q: Can I use the word "Tor" as part of the name of my product or my domain name?
A: Please don't use Tor in your product name or domain name. Instead, find a name that will accurately identify your products or services. Remember that our goal is to make sure that people aren't confused about whether your product or project is made or endorsed by The Tor Project. Creating a new brand that incorporates the Tor brand is likely to lead to confusion, and commercial confusion is a sign of trademark infringement.
https://www.torproject.org/about/trademark/#trademark-faq-3
Best, Gus -- The Tor Project Community Team Lead
-- The Tor Project Community Team Lead
Hi all, - A shamefully basic question please: This statistics / metrics http://dud2sxm6feahhuwj4y4lzktduy7v3qpaqsfkggtj2ojmzathttkegoid.onion/bandwi... offers two variables: + factor + values *what are the units and formula for the bandwidth ?* bandwidth = factor * values in *KiloBytes *Any insight really welcome, Cheers:).
On 9/10/24 20:17, eff_03675549@posteo.se wrote:
Hi all,
- A shamefully basic question please:
This statistics / metrics
http://dud2sxm6feahhuwj4y4lzktduy7v3qpaqsfkggtj2ojmzathttkegoid.onion/bandwi...
offers two variables:
+ factor
+ values
*what are the units and formula for the bandwidth ?* bandwidth = factor * values in *KiloBytes
*Any insight really welcome, Cheers:).
Hello, Onionoo uses a sort of time series approach when responding with what it calls history objects. These are defined here: https://metrics.torproject.org/onionoo.html#history The factor is a sort of compression that we use to reduce the document size. Here are the details about bw documents: https://metrics.torproject.org/onionoo.html#bandwidth Hope this helps. Let me know if you have other questions. Cheers, -hiro
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participants (5)
-
boldsuck -
coal_norm_0v＠icloud.com -
eff_03675549＠posteo.se -
gus -
Hiro