Identify from which continent people connect from
Hi, a while ago (10.02.2023) I tried to send an email on the tor-talk mailing list but apparently it never got through as it's still awaiting approval. (it wasn't denied either, afaik) So, I'll try my luck here as this is sort of censorship related, too. Copy and paste of the email: --- Hi, recently, there was an interesting side note on the cryptography mailing list [1]. Quote:
(People have written code to predict what continent an anonymous person using Tor is on, based on noticing over a period of time when their remote system clocks ran faster or slower, assuming that was caused by nighttime versus daytime temperatures.)
I was wondering if any of you know about this and where I could find code that does this? Any links to research and papers would be highly appreciated, too. Especially, I'm wondering how they do this: - via differences in the above mentioned system clock (impressive?!) - timing analysis with latency? things like lower latency in Europe as there are more tor relays around compared to Argentina. - do you need to have any prerequisites? e.g. controlling at least one node, or the exit node, or a "clear text" server/hidden service that someone connects to? Finally, if that's the wrong list, please refer me to the right one. Thanks! [1]: https://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2023-February/038109.html
Quoting mxz+tor-anti-censorship-team--- via anti-censorship-team (2023-03-20 22:31:23)
a while ago (10.02.2023) I tried to send an email on the tor-talk mailing list but apparently it never got through as it's still awaiting approval. (it wasn't denied either, afaik)
I think tor-talk is being having less and less movement in favor of the forum[0], but we should either close the list or take care of the moderation. Sorry.
recently, there was an interesting side note on the cryptography mailing list [1]. Quote:
(People have written code to predict what continent an anonymous person using Tor is on, based on noticing over a period of time when their remote system clocks ran faster or slower, assuming that was caused by nighttime versus daytime temperatures.)
I was wondering if any of you know about this and where I could find code that does this? Any links to research and papers would be highly appreciated, too.
Especially, I'm wondering how they do this:
- via differences in the above mentioned system clock (impressive?!) - timing analysis with latency? things like lower latency in Europe as there are more tor relays around compared to Argentina. - do you need to have any prerequisites? e.g. controlling at least one node, or the exit node, or a "clear text" server/hidden service that someone connects to?
Finally, if that's the wrong list, please refer me to the right one. Thanks!
[1]: https://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2023-February/038109.html
I didn't know about that. You can ask in the forum[0], maybe someone there knows about it. [0] https://forum.torproject.net -- meskio | https://meskio.net/ -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- My contact info: https://meskio.net/crypto.txt -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Nos vamos a Croatan.
no worries, thanks for letting me know that the conversation moved to the forum.
On Mon, Mar 20, 2023 at 03:31:23PM -0600, mxz+tor-anti-censorship-team--- via anti-censorship-team wrote:
recently, there was an interesting side note on the cryptography mailing list [1]. Quote:
(People have written code to predict what continent an anonymous person using Tor is on, based on noticing over a period of time when their remote system clocks ran faster or slower, assuming that was caused by nighttime versus daytime temperatures.)
I was wondering if any of you know about this and where I could find code that does this? Any links to research and papers would be highly appreciated, too.
Especially, I'm wondering how they do this:
- via differences in the above mentioned system clock (impressive?!) - timing analysis with latency? things like lower latency in Europe as there are more tor relays around compared to Argentina. - do you need to have any prerequisites? e.g. controlling at least one node, or the exit node, or a "clear text" server/hidden service that someone connects to?
It sounds like they are referring to "Hot or Not: Revealing Hidden Services by their Clock Skew" from 2006. https://www.freehaven.net/anonbib/#HotOrNot Section 5.3 is about geolocation.
Longitude could simply be found by finding the daily peak temperature to establish local time. To find latitude, the change in day length over a reasonably long period could be used. ... national holidays or when daylight saving time comes into effect might be evident
On 3/21/23 10:28, David Fifield wrote:
It sounds like they are referring to "Hot or Not: Revealing Hidden Services by their Clock Skew" from 2006.
https://www.freehaven.net/anonbib/#HotOrNot
Section 5.3 is about geolocation.
Longitude could simply be found by finding the daily peak temperature to establish local time. To find latitude, the change in day length over a reasonably long period could be used. ... national holidays or when daylight saving time comes into effect might be evident
Impressive. Thanks! https://www.freehaven.net/anonbib/ seems to be a great collection of papers in anonymity. Are there other websites I may not know of specifically about anonymity, privacy, and similar?
On Wed, Mar 22, 2023 at 11:13:57AM -0600, mxz+tor-anti-censorship-team--- via anti-censorship-team wrote:
https://www.freehaven.net/anonbib/ seems to be a great collection of papers in anonymity. Are there other websites I may not know of specifically about anonymity, privacy, and similar?
For censorship specifically there is https://censorbib.nymity.ch/. For privacy, one source is the programs of past Privacy Enhancing Technologies Symposiums: https://petsymposium.org/2023/past-pets.php
On 3/22/23 11:41, David Fifield wrote:
On Wed, Mar 22, 2023 at 11:13:57AM -0600, mxz+tor-anti-censorship-team--- via anti-censorship-team wrote:
https://www.freehaven.net/anonbib/ seems to be a great collection of papers in anonymity. Are there other websites I may not know of specifically about anonymity, privacy, and similar?
For censorship specifically there is https://censorbib.nymity.ch/.
For privacy, one source is the programs of past Privacy Enhancing Technologies Symposiums: https://petsymposium.org/2023/past-pets.php
Fantastic, thank you!
participants (3)
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David Fifield -
meskio -
mxz+tor-anti-censorship-team＠mxzero.de