[tor-teachers] tor-teachers - politics

Jens Kubieziel maillist at kubieziel.de
Wed Oct 21 08:21:32 UTC 2015

* malte at wk3.org schrieb am 2015-10-21 um 09:21 Uhr:
> Quoting Alison Macrina (2015-10-21 04:47:46)
> > I personally would love to hear people share their stories around
> > educating civic organizations and civil society groups -- and not just
> > the police-- about Tor. I educate librarians *because* of the status
> > they enjoy within their communities. But I don't want to dominate the
> > conversation, so let's hear from someone else. :)
> I know that the people of Torservers.net/Zwiebelfreunde educate german
> police about Tor because they would always think "A crime was comitted
> from that IP [of a Tor exit node], it _must_ have been the person
> renting the server!".

I had my first contact with the police while running a Mixmaster
remailer (anonymous mails). Back then I got an invitation to talk to
them as a witness. While every lawyer tells you: »Don't talk to the
police.«, I decided to do so. I clearly had the impression, that while
they invited me as a witness, they treated me more like a suspect.
However I explained the techhnology and why I did it and the
conversation went well.

I had this kind of conversation again from time to time. While I talked
every time to another police officer there was one special person who
was computer literate and understood anonymising technologies. He always
attended those meetings and explained it to his colleagues in »police
words«. ;)

Later I heard that Roger and others had talked to LEAs in Germany and
offered our police station the same (Someone does a Tor talk). The
officers were really interested and supported me. However everything had
to go through the press office of our federal police (LKA) and they
turned it down. Later I talked to the head of this LKA and he told me
that they only accept official courses. He obviously had no interest in

However a few years later I came in contact with the Cybercrime Unit of
the LKA. They saw Tor as a sole tool for criminals. So I talked to them
for several hours and explained the (good) use of Tor. In the end they
thanked me that I »opened their eyes« and said that they see Tor a bit
different now.

So from time to time I talk to police officers, detectives etc. and try
to convince them of the good uses. However at least here in Thuringia I
never had the chance to do something »official«.

Jens Kubieziel                                   http://www.kubieziel.de
Das Linux-System starten und als Wurzel anmelden...  (aus der Anleitung zur
Treiberinstallation einer SATA-Karte)
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