I concur with all you say below.
Exceptionally well spoken. Evidently you have some solid experience in your corporate managerial role.
Thanks for speaking up.
On Sun, Aug 21, 2016 at 11:50:37PM -0700, Arisbe wrote:
Okay, so I've been concerned about the safety of at-risk Tor users since all this shit broke. New employees at the organizational structure serving as the main accuser, an all new board with interrelationships and motivation unknown, grenades rolled under office doors and all of the rest leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I cannot, at this time, recommend to a third world citizen, that (s)he trust the Tor network. I hope that changes. The issue is whether or not someone new in the Tor organization will, accidentally or intentionally, put third world users at risk. I cannot trust an all-new board. Tor needs to be on their best behavior in order for me to re-establish trust in the organization. As a retired corporate manager I've seen these problems before. I have several suggestions that I feel are must-do tasks for the Tor Project:
- Secure an independent investigator to look into the allegations against Jacob. Either demonstrate that he is not
an honorable employee or reinstate him. No one should trust anonymous claims that can ruin his career. If Jacob is guilty, he should be prosecuted; 2) Board member should be open, accessible and available to employees and node operators. Their background and motivation for being a director of the Tor Project should be disseminated. There interrelationship with other board members should be known; 3) As one of the founders of Tor, Roger should openly discuss these and all issues in a public manner (on the web page, webinar, magazine article, etc.); 4) An organizational plan should be placed in the employment manual that puts significant distance between coding employees and directors; 5) Employees and directors should not operate nor have access to authority servers. I've operated a number of exits and guards for several years now (including, as far as I know, the only Tor node in Albania). [1] I will leave these operational for now but I expect changes in this unprofessionally operated 501c3. [1]
A827646DD0F8B92A9963789529CEE3141FF74761 4061C553CA88021B8302F0814365070AAE617270 C80DF89B21FF932DEC0D7821F679B6C79E1449C3 9B31F1F1C1554F9FFB3455911F82E818EF7C7883 D3E5EDDBE5159388704D6785BE51930AAFACEC6F
Arisbe arisbe@cni.net writes:
I agree in general with a lot of what is said here, but I have to take issue with one point:
Okay, so I've been concerned about the safety of at-risk Tor users since all this shit broke. New employees at the organizational structure serving as the main accuser, an all new board with interrelationships and motivation unknown, grenades rolled under office doors and all of the rest leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I cannot, at this time, recommend to a third world citizen, that (s)he trust the Tor network. I hope that changes. The issue is whether or not someone new in the Tor organization will, accidentally or intentionally, put third world users at risk. I cannot trust an all-new board. Tor needs to be on their best behavior in order for me to re-establish trust in the organization. As a retired corporate manager I've seen these problems before. I have several suggestions that I feel are must-do tasks for the Tor Project: 1) Secure an independent investigator to look into the allegations against Jacob. Either demonstrate that he is not an honorable employee or reinstate him. No one should trust anonymous claims that can ruin his career. If Jacob is guilty, he should be prosecuted;
... and this is it.
I've seen this now over and over in these discussions: if Applebaum is guilty then some legal action must follow.
Involving your local legal system in rape and sexual misconduct cases is problematic for many reasons. I highly encourage anyone who thinks that the obvious answer to the kinds of wrongdoing that Jacob Applebaum is accused of is "the courts" to read *something* about rape culture. Here are three links that aren't bad starting points:
http://time.com/40110/rape-culture-is-real/ http://jezebel.com/5822649/why-a-rape-doesnt-get-prosecuted http://everydayfeminism.com/2014/03/examples-of-rape-culture/
I would also encourage anyone who thinks the police or court system of any country on the planet are always good ways to resolve these issues should also read this article and follow the links in it:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/03/18/idaho-sheriff-said-mo...
There are obviously a lot more articles online about this issue, and I want to stress that this goes well beyond these accusations against a specfic person. The cries of "due process" (whatever that means wherever you happen to be) and "if it's true charge him with a crime" sound thin and naive to me. They are based on assumptions that aren't true. If you accept this then the actions of the accusers in this case don't look so strange or off-base and the constant scolding to let the courts decide guilt or innocence look hollow. It also means that the real path forward is not so clean or easy.
2) Board member should be open, accessible and available to employees and node operators. Their background and motivation for being a director of the Tor Project should be disseminated. There interrelationship with other board members should be known; 3) As one of the founders of Tor, Roger should openly discuss these and all issues in a public manner (on the web page, webinar, magazine article, etc.); 4) An organizational plan should be placed in the employment manual that puts significant distance between coding employees and directors; 5) Employees and directors should not operate nor have access to authority servers. I've operated a number of exits and guards for several years now (including, as far as I know, the only Tor node in Albania). [1] I will leave these operational for now but I expect changes in this unprofessionally operated 501c3. [1] <table style="border-collapse: collapse;" height="110" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="410"> <colgroup><col style="mso-width-source:userset;mso-width-alt:12316;width:260pt" width="346"> </colgroup><tbody> <tr style="height:14.4pt" height="19"> <td style="height:14.4pt;width:260pt" height="19" width="346">A827646DD0F8B92A9963789529CEE3141FF74761 </td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.4pt" height="19"> <td style="height:14.4pt" height="19">4061C553CA88021B8302F0814365070AAE617270 </td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.4pt" height="19"> <td style="height:14.4pt" height="19">C80DF89B21FF932DEC0D7821F679B6C79E1449C3 </td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.4pt" height="19"> <td style="height:14.4pt" height="19">9B31F1F1C1554F9FFB3455911F82E818EF7C7883 </td> </tr> <tr style="height:14.4pt" height="19"> <td style="height:14.4pt" height="19">D3E5EDDBE5159388704D6785BE51930AAFACEC6F </td> </tr> </tbody> </table>
-- http://haqistan.net/~attila | attila@haqistan.net | 0x62A729CF
Personally, the expulsion of Appelbaum and the replacement of the board make me *more* confident in the Tor organization. The relays I run, B6C7FAFFFCEFC30541D38F33E25B1E0DB135C5D8 (non-exit) and 78C7C299DB4C4BD119A22B87B57D5AF5F3741A79 (exit), will NOT be participating in this "strike".
I am making this announcement because we have to physically move the computer running the exit sometime in the next week or so, and it may be down for a couple of days, depending on how long it takes the network admins to reconfigure things. This is merely an unfortunate coincidence of timing. The non-exit will remain up.
zw
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Dear team,
Speaking as a former Tor board member and as a relay and bridge node operator, I'm more confident in Tor than ever before. I'm pleased with the new leadership team as well as the direction of the Tor Project. I'm pleased with the careful and caring manner in which issues have been handled. I'm pleased with how the community has rallied to build and inclusive and welcoming place to further the cause of freedom.
We at Team Cymru remain firmly committed to the Tor Project, and will do all we can to help the Tor Project and community grow.
We will not participate in any strike, or any other action that adversely impacts the dissidents and freedom-seekers of the world.
Be well, Rabbi Rob. - -- Rabbi Rob Thomas Team Cymru "It is easy to believe in freedom of speech for those with whom we agree." - Leo McKern
Hi, I'm a white-boy from a silly-old-town.
I would like to express my perspective on the sexual assault/abuse/exploitation. The western culture we have collectively created, where women are the lesser equals, and this underlining tone of male arrogance that if a women was sexually abused/exploited that she wanted it, was looking for it, or even enjoyed it (I speak from my past-perspective on these type of scenarios, although wrong. Where did this ideology originate from? I can't be the only one? After I became aware of this behavior pattern, it became clear that this was a cultural belief system that was adopted). If the alleged abuser, and the several victims are within the same organization, and if the abuser is in a position of power, drastic actions needs to taken, and quick (The risk is too great, for the abuser to take action, out of fear, and use/abuse her/his power. Nothing good will ever come from actions motivated by fear). You can not expect to wait for or rely on the Law System to give you a verdict. If several victims are speaking out, and not all anonymously, that ought to be a strong indication of wrong doing.
We are not progressing as a species, because of beings in a position of power exploiting those without.
Do not let these situations change your behavior towards the Tor Project, by sabotaging the progress of the project. We all have a vision of the greatness Tor can bring to mankind. We the people are Tor, keep taking actions that will build us. Stay focused on the true fight.
With Love, Rastaman
O na kar maan rupaiye wala bar bar ke na rajje
tor-relays mailing list tor-relays@lists.torproject.org https://lists.torproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tor-relays
We have 2016 not 1950. Update your ntp server.
assault/abuse/exploitation. The western culture we have collectively created, where women are the lesser equals, and this underlining tone of male arrogance that if a women was sexually abused/exploited that she wanted it, was looking for it, or even enjoyed it (I speak from my past-perspective on these type of scenarios, although wrong.
tor-relays@lists.torproject.org
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Arisbe -
attila -
Markus Koch -
Rabbi Rob Thomas -
rastaman -
Zack Weinberg -
Zenaan Harkness