[tor-dev] Freenet + Onioncat: Is the traffic welcome?

grarpamp grarpamp at gmail.com
Thu Jun 23 19:38:39 UTC 2016

On 6/22/16, konstant at mail2tor.com <konstant at mail2tor.com> wrote:
> I want to be clear about a couple of things. I am not looking to defy the
> wishes of Tor developers and relay contributors. I hope to get their views
> on the matter. Should they explicitly refuse, I will look at I2P.

When I ran, donated, managed relays... only wanted all of what
I paid for to be consumed. "Wished" it would be in alignment
with certain ideals, but realized that's not reality.

For more and different opinions from relays, you might want to
post to tor-relays@ referencing the archive url to this thread.

> Second, my idea does not touch Exit bandwidth at all. We will only deploy
> hidden services.

Yeah, it's freenet over tor. Makes for an interesting definition
of hidden service. Don't forget to add around 1000+ ms latency.

> Wasting resources is abusive. However, comparing bittorrent traffic to
> Freenet doesn't do it justice. Freenet is used by dissidents for freedom
> of speech and publishing small static files like blogs, not to share gigs
> of media files.

Anonymous uncensorable overlay networks, are "used" by
whoever, for whatever, limited only by the techinical and practical
capabilities of each network. There are many "gigs of media files"
being shared over freenet and other nets by many happy and even
wasteful users. This fact understandably burns the britches of
those who intend their network to be used only for some other
purposes. It happens.

There seems to be ongoing and growing interest around the
world in overlay nets and parallel wire[less] 'guerilla' nets,
and lots of room for improved and new code and models.
No worries here.

> [arma] the main rule is that if you're going to add traffic to tor, run
some relays to match
> [arma] for hidden services, that's 1MB/s of traffic onto 6 places, so 6MB/s

This has always been my position. Each user of these "free"
community powered networks has an impact. For some nets
this has readily calculable minimums, like tor and its 6x minimum
for exclusively non-exit (HS) use. Other nets or usage models
may be roughly estimated. Therefore each user of such networks
should know / learn the impact for their respective network.
And should realize that they are in a way obligated to return
the resources they consume, as otherwise their network will
not have headroom and their own experience will go downhill fast.

> Freenet has 10KiB/s minimum bandwidth requirement.

Note that the correct form for engineering, and apps interfacing
at the level of, network traffic rates... is bits (b), not bytes (B),
and decimal prefixes, not binary prefixes.

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