<div dir="ltr">Looks like the BBC have changed their rules. I am still running a relay, but can now access <a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk">www.bbc.co.uk</a> in a normal fashion. <div><br></div><div>Still blocked by national lottery, but I'm hopeful that they both use the same third party ip checker, and that the next lottery update will fix the issue.<br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 10:41 PM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:tor-relays-request@lists.torproject.org" target="_blank">tor-relays-request@lists.torproject.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Send tor-relays mailing list submissions to<br>
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<br>Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. RELAY_EARLY tor network update status (CVE-2014-5117) (Nusenu)<br>
2. Re: BBC and UK Lottery blocking ip addresses running relay<br>
(Ross Petrie)<br>
3. Re: BBC and UK Lottery blocking ip addresses running relay<br>
(Chris Whittleston)<br>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: Nusenu <<a href="mailto:BM-2D8wMEVgGVY76je1WXNPfo8SrpZt5yGHES@bitmessage.ch">BM-2D8wMEVgGVY76je1WXNPfo8SrpZt5yGHES@bitmessage.ch</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:tor-relays@lists.torproject.org">tor-relays@lists.torproject.org</a><br>Cc: <a href="mailto:markus@mdfnet.se">markus@mdfnet.se</a>, <a href="mailto:info@enn.lu">info@enn.lu</a>, <a href="mailto:torpids@yahoo.com">torpids@yahoo.com</a>, <a href="mailto:nick@calyx.com">nick@calyx.com</a><br>Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 21:00:41 +0000<br>Subject: [tor-relays] RELAY_EARLY tor network update status (CVE-2014-5117)<br>(if you are on the CC list of this email you are probably one of the tor<br>
relay operators running one of the 10 fastest vulnerable [CVE-2014-5117]<br>
relays on the tor network. Please upgrade your tor relay)<br>
<br>
> The tor network is currently at 64% of the bandwidth being served by<br>
> relays running a recommended version according to <a href="http://torstatus.blutmagie.de" target="_blank">torstatus.blutmagie.de</a>.<br>
> I updated a previous metrics feature request so we might see nice<br>
> graphs about patching progress in the future [2].<br>
<br>
Since we are seeing active RELAY_EARLY attacks again (or new buggy tor<br>
implemantations) I was wondering what the current update stats look like.<br>
<br>
~85%* of the tor network's bandwidth is provided by patched relays.<br>
(~66% 0.2.4.23, ~11% 0.2.5.6-alpha, ~7% 0.2.5.7-rc)<br>
<br>
*) according to data from <a href="http://torstatus.blutmagie.de" target="_blank">torstatus.blutmagie.de</a><br>
<br>
<br>
10 fastest relays still running a vulnerable version:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/EC98311F9EC02BEAA183651CE8402249CD036D0A" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/EC98311F9EC02BEAA183651CE8402249CD036D0A</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/D1271A1E15C568DA709D3A1E68188EEAE8DDB834" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/D1271A1E15C568DA709D3A1E68188EEAE8DDB834</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/12AD30E5D25AA67F519780E2111E611A455FDC89" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/12AD30E5D25AA67F519780E2111E611A455FDC89</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/1B9FACF25E17D26E307EA7CFA7D455B144B032E5" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/1B9FACF25E17D26E307EA7CFA7D455B144B032E5</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/2F57987F3942BA0BBD706D623F1FF86A896842C2" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/2F57987F3942BA0BBD706D623F1FF86A896842C2</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/379FB450010D17078B3766C2273303C358C3A442" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/379FB450010D17078B3766C2273303C358C3A442</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/935BABE2564F82016C19AEF63C0C40B5753BA3D2" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/935BABE2564F82016C19AEF63C0C40B5753BA3D2</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/B83DC1558F0D34353BB992EF93AFEAFDB226A73E" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/B83DC1558F0D34353BB992EF93AFEAFDB226A73E</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/104A9453FD93BDBEAE9E2024898266AD2051A1BD" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/104A9453FD93BDBEAE9E2024898266AD2051A1BD</a><br>
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/C11650E31F83E149C855D574B3171CC9CF9BEE19" target="_blank">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/C11650E31F83E149C855D574B3171CC9CF9BEE19</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: Ross Petrie <<a href="mailto:ross.petrie@gmail.com">ross.petrie@gmail.com</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:tor-relays@lists.torproject.org">tor-relays@lists.torproject.org</a><br>Cc: <br>Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 22:18:05 +0100<br>Subject: Re: [tor-relays] BBC and UK Lottery blocking ip addresses running relay<br><p dir="ltr">Hi all,</p>
<p dir="ltr">I've just reported this same issue this week, no reply yet.</p>
<p dir="ltr">I can still watch catch up BBC TV through my sky box though.</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 18 Sep 2014 21:40, "Dan Hanley" <<a href="mailto:hanley.dan@gmail.com" target="_blank">hanley.dan@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><br></blockquote><div>I have just received a slightly more positive reply:</div><div><br></div><div>"<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">At present, our GeoIP data provider classes Tor nodes as proxies, regardless of whether or not they're an exit node. We understand that there is room for improvement in this model, since non-exit relays do not present traffic on behalf of other users. We have asked our provider to give us a way of differentiating Tor exit nodes from non-exit relays, to allow us to block exit nodes only."</span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">So perhaps they will make a change... certainly reporting the issue seems to raise its importance :-)</span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">atb</span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">Dan</span></div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"> </blockquote><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"> 5. Re: BBC and UK Lottery blocking ip addresses running relay<br>
nodes (Chris Whittleston)<br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: Chris Whittleston <<a href="mailto:csw34@cam.ac.uk" target="_blank">csw34@cam.ac.uk</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:tor-relays@lists.torproject.org" target="_blank">tor-relays@lists.torproject.org</a><br>Cc: <br>Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 01:40:31 +0100<br>Subject: Re: [tor-relays] BBC and UK Lottery blocking ip addresses running relay nodes<br><div dir="ltr">Yeah ouch - maybe I just got someone a bit more helpful. I'm with Matt though, it seems like they still don't get the difference between using Tor as a client and running a relay, so this isn't the end of the road there. You are going to have to rely on them wanting to actually think about it though.<div><br></div><div>If all else fails, you could always try to simply report the issue again using the form I linked before, but this time just don't mention Tor at all and see if you get a different customer service person...</div><div><br></div><div><a href="http://iplayerhelp.external.bbc.co.uk/tv/incorrect_location_may2014" target="_blank">http://iplayerhelp.external.bbc.co.uk/tv/incorrect_location_may2014</a><br></div><div><br></div><div>I suspect you'll end up having to explain that you're running a relay in the end anyway, but you never know.</div><div><br></div><div>Chris</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 17 September 2014 21:48, Matt Puckey <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:matt@puckey.org" target="_blank">matt@puckey.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">Stephen Mollett:<br>
> [...]<br>
> "Thank you for contacting the BBC iPlayer support team.<br>
><br>
> "I understand you’re experiencing problems accessing BBC iPlayer as<br>
> you’re told that you are outside of the UK.<br>
><br>
> "Please note that if you run TOR, then I’m afraid as per our development<br>
> team’s confirmation you’ll not be able to access BBC iPlayer. If you<br>
> continue to use TOR then your IP address may be blacklisted against UK<br>
> only services across <a href="http://bbc.co.uk" target="_blank">bbc.co.uk</a>."<br>
><br>
> I made a point of stating explicitly in my original case filing that I<br>
> run a middle relay and that no traffic exits from my node to the BBC's<br>
> website or to anywhere else, along with a link to my node's stats on<br>
> blutmagie confirming the (non-)exit policy.<br>
> [...]<br>
<br>
Hi Stephen,<br>
<br>
I'm not sure whether I'm surprised at the BBC or not!<br>
<br>
It is a shame if they seem to be doing blanket blocking of Tor relay IP<br>
addresses. I suppose this<br>
(<a href="https://blog.torproject.org/blog/call-arms-helping-internet-services-accept-anonymous-users" target="_blank">https://blog.torproject.org/blog/call-arms-helping-internet-services-accept-anonymous-users</a>)<br>
has /some/ relevance.<br>
<br>
The problem is obviously convincing a organisation like the BBC to treat<br>
individual IP addresses different from other Tor relay IP addresses (and<br>
whether they should be doing that at all). Although it seems Chris<br>
Whittleston obviously managed it! Maybe you simply got 'the wrong person<br>
at the other end'. Personally, I would continue to pursue this with them!<br>
<span><font color="#888888"><br>
--Matt<br>
</font></span><div><div><br>
<br>
<br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><b>Dr Chris Whittleston 栗主</b><br>Department of Chemistry<br>University of Cambridge<br>Lensfield Road, Cambridge, CB2 1EW<br>Email: <a href="mailto:csw34@cam.ac.uk" target="_blank">csw34@cam.ac.uk</a><br>Tel: <a href="tel:%2B44%20%280%291223%20336423" value="+441223336423" target="_blank">+44 (0)1223 336423</a>
</div>
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<br></blockquote></div><br></div></div>
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<br></blockquote></div>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: Chris Whittleston <<a href="mailto:csw34@cam.ac.uk">csw34@cam.ac.uk</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:tor-relays@lists.torproject.org">tor-relays@lists.torproject.org</a><br>Cc: <br>Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 22:41:04 +0100<br>Subject: Re: [tor-relays] BBC and UK Lottery blocking ip addresses running relay<br><p dir="ltr">That's great news Dan, keep us posted!</p>
<p dir="ltr">Chris</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 18 Sep 2014 21:40, "Dan Hanley" <<a href="mailto:hanley.dan@gmail.com" target="_blank">hanley.dan@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><br></blockquote><div>I have just received a slightly more positive reply:</div><div><br></div><div>"<span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">At present, our GeoIP data provider classes Tor nodes as proxies, regardless of whether or not they're an exit node. We understand that there is room for improvement in this model, since non-exit relays do not present traffic on behalf of other users. We have asked our provider to give us a way of differentiating Tor exit nodes from non-exit relays, to allow us to block exit nodes only."</span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">So perhaps they will make a change... certainly reporting the issue seems to raise its importance :-)</span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">atb</span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">Dan</span></div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"> </blockquote><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"> 5. Re: BBC and UK Lottery blocking ip addresses running relay<br>
nodes (Chris Whittleston)<br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: Chris Whittleston <<a href="mailto:csw34@cam.ac.uk" target="_blank">csw34@cam.ac.uk</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:tor-relays@lists.torproject.org" target="_blank">tor-relays@lists.torproject.org</a><br>Cc: <br>Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 01:40:31 +0100<br>Subject: Re: [tor-relays] BBC and UK Lottery blocking ip addresses running relay nodes<br><div dir="ltr">Yeah ouch - maybe I just got someone a bit more helpful. I'm with Matt though, it seems like they still don't get the difference between using Tor as a client and running a relay, so this isn't the end of the road there. You are going to have to rely on them wanting to actually think about it though.<div><br></div><div>If all else fails, you could always try to simply report the issue again using the form I linked before, but this time just don't mention Tor at all and see if you get a different customer service person...</div><div><br></div><div><a href="http://iplayerhelp.external.bbc.co.uk/tv/incorrect_location_may2014" target="_blank">http://iplayerhelp.external.bbc.co.uk/tv/incorrect_location_may2014</a><br></div><div><br></div><div>I suspect you'll end up having to explain that you're running a relay in the end anyway, but you never know.</div><div><br></div><div>Chris</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 17 September 2014 21:48, Matt Puckey <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:matt@puckey.org" target="_blank">matt@puckey.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">Stephen Mollett:<br>
> [...]<br>
> "Thank you for contacting the BBC iPlayer support team.<br>
><br>
> "I understand you’re experiencing problems accessing BBC iPlayer as<br>
> you’re told that you are outside of the UK.<br>
><br>
> "Please note that if you run TOR, then I’m afraid as per our development<br>
> team’s confirmation you’ll not be able to access BBC iPlayer. If you<br>
> continue to use TOR then your IP address may be blacklisted against UK<br>
> only services across <a href="http://bbc.co.uk" target="_blank">bbc.co.uk</a>."<br>
><br>
> I made a point of stating explicitly in my original case filing that I<br>
> run a middle relay and that no traffic exits from my node to the BBC's<br>
> website or to anywhere else, along with a link to my node's stats on<br>
> blutmagie confirming the (non-)exit policy.<br>
> [...]<br>
<br>
Hi Stephen,<br>
<br>
I'm not sure whether I'm surprised at the BBC or not!<br>
<br>
It is a shame if they seem to be doing blanket blocking of Tor relay IP<br>
addresses. I suppose this<br>
(<a href="https://blog.torproject.org/blog/call-arms-helping-internet-services-accept-anonymous-users" target="_blank">https://blog.torproject.org/blog/call-arms-helping-internet-services-accept-anonymous-users</a>)<br>
has /some/ relevance.<br>
<br>
The problem is obviously convincing a organisation like the BBC to treat<br>
individual IP addresses different from other Tor relay IP addresses (and<br>
whether they should be doing that at all). Although it seems Chris<br>
Whittleston obviously managed it! Maybe you simply got 'the wrong person<br>
at the other end'. Personally, I would continue to pursue this with them!<br>
<span><font color="#888888"><br>
--Matt<br>
</font></span><div><div><br>
<br>
<br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><b>Dr Chris Whittleston 栗主</b><br>Department of Chemistry<br>University of Cambridge<br>Lensfield Road, Cambridge, CB2 1EW<br>Email: <a href="mailto:csw34@cam.ac.uk" target="_blank">csw34@cam.ac.uk</a><br>Tel: <a href="tel:%2B44%20%280%291223%20336423" value="+441223336423" target="_blank">+44 (0)1223 336423</a>
</div>
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<br></blockquote></div><br></div></div>
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