<blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 40px;border:none;padding:0px"><br><div class="gmail_quote">---------- Forwarded message ----------</div><div class="gmail_quote">From: <b class="gmail_sendername">TechFix LTD</b> <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:andrew@techfixuk.com">andrew@techfixuk.com</a>></span></div>
<div class="gmail_quote">Date: Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 8:25 AM</div><div class="gmail_quote">Subject: Re: [tor-assistants] Call for discussion: turning funding into more exit relays</div><div class="gmail_quote">To: Roger Dingledine <<a href="mailto:arma@mit.edu">arma@mit.edu</a>></div>
<div class="gmail_quote">Cc: <a href="mailto:tor-relays@lists.torproject.org">tor-relays@lists.torproject.org</a></div><div class="gmail_quote"><br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote">
<div class="im">On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 5:03 AM, Roger Dingledine <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:arma@mit.edu" target="_blank">arma@mit.edu</a>></span> wrote:</div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote">
<div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div>Sounds like you should bump it up to 100mbit then. ;)</div></blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote">
<div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><div><br></div></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Heh, I've just done exactly that - well, I've raised the bandwidth limits in my torrc to values higher than what my ISP caps my connection at. Just to clarify though, is there any technical reason why it would be better practice to have a realistic configured limit (like 12.5MB) as the limit rather than something higher than that which I know will likely never actually be possible? I simply want to use all the bandwidth available.</div>
</div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>I'll monitor the websites I'm hosting from this server closely for a while and see if they are noticeably affected by this at all. They are hosted from a separate VM and I'm not sure how the OpenVZ host schedules packets going through the virtual network adapters, but I'm hoping that tor can run at maximum capacity most of the time while only adding perhaps a second or two of load time onto the websites.</div>
</div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><div> </div></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
You can see on</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><a href="http://atlas.torproject.org/#details/FA02311AF49EB663CA2685A8604C403A9E10E6E3" target="_blank">http://atlas.torproject.org/#details/FA02311AF49EB663CA2685A8604C403A9E10E6E3</a></blockquote>
</div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
that there are periods where your rate limiting is bottlenecking traffic.</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><div> </div></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote">
<div class="gmail_quote"><div>I presume you're referring to the busy periods where the graph clips? Sure, but as my company pays for the server entirely, if it were to not function for its intended purpose (basic hosting of small-time client websites) I would have a problem. I was worried that allowing tor to use all my bandwidth would cause that, but I hadn't actually experimented with it to see - I'm doing that now!</div>
</div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><br></div></blockquote></div></div></div>
<div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">I definitely don't want Tor to be in the middle of the transactions --</blockquote>
</div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
if Tor pays the bills directly, that's too much like being the relay</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
operator. One nice situation would be for you to produce receipts showing</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
expenses, and then we reimburse those costs. It requires fronting a bit</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
of money on your part, but that's part of saving the world, yes? :)</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br></blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Ultimately, we're also going to want to look into reducing overhead on</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Tor's side from sending out money. If we have to write and mail 50 checks</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
every month, that's going to waste a lot of somebody's time. Maybe that</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
means Paypal is the way to go. Maybe it means we send some money in bulk</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
to Zwiebelfreunde, and they do intra-Europe wire transfers to the other</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Europeans (though I admit maybe that just shifts the time-wasting). Lots</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
of options there. What would be best for you?</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><div><br></div></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote">
<div>Good point. I guess the solution which seems logical to me would be a standing order from Tor into my company account for the amount mentioned above, with my OVH invoice emailed to you as justification. As the amount would not change from month to month, a standing order could be set up once and never require any more attention unless I got cut off by OVH.</div>
</div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Presumably that would require a european bank account under Tor's control - I'm not sure about how your connection with the Wau Holland Foundation works, but are they perhaps able to help with european transfers?</div>
</div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>If that is too awkward, then sure, PayPal (or one of several other e-Payment systems) is a fairly easy way to go about it, with the loss of a few % of the payment amount. My business currently uses PayPal for all payments from US entities, simply because it is easy.</div>
</div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><div> </div></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
All of this said, don't go out and start spending money quite yet.</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
We should figure out these logistics first. And Tor should get a bit</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
more of a handle on what this diversity thing should mean. And I should</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
get buy-in from other Tor people for my plans here. :)</blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<span><font color="#888888"><br></font></span></blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<span><font color="#888888">
--Roger</font></span></blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<span><font color="#888888"><br></font></span></blockquote></div></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><br></div><div class="gmail_quote">I'm going to try my best to run my current node as a full 100Mbit node from now on anyway, even if that means paying for more traffic.</div>
<div class="gmail_quote"><div>As soon as things are ready at your end, I'm ready to start a second identical exit as described in my previous mail.</div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div>I'm going to try and start looking for other providers, but I don't want to reinvent the wheel - is <a href="https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/GoodBadISPs" target="_blank">https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/doc/GoodBadISPs</a> kept up to date by many people here? Perhaps we could develop a slightly better system for tracking good/bad ISP experiences than a flat wiki page with countries?</div>
<div><br></div></div></blockquote>So my node has been running without any bandwidth restriction for a few days now, and I'm not noticing any critical speed problems from the websites I host. The latency drops significantly when the node is pushing traffic at max bandwidth, but that doesn't seem to be very often (
<a href="https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/FA02311AF49EB663CA2685A8604C403A9E10E6E3">https://atlas.torproject.org/#details/FA02311AF49EB663CA2685A8604C403A9E10E6E3</a> ). So, as it stands right now, I'm happy to run that node for free as I already have been. If the OVH manager decides I am very close to my initial 10TB traffic cap, I will have to limit the node again unless I can get some funding (£9-£18) for another 20TB each month.<div>
<br></div><div>Out of curiosity, can anyone explain to me why my bandwidth /hasn't/ been maxed out the past few days? (at least, according to Atlas)</div><div><br></div><div>-- </div><div><div><b style="font-weight:bold"><div style="font-weight:normal;display:inline!important">
<font><font color="#888888"><strong>Andrew Beveridge, </strong></font></font></div></b><i><span style="color:rgb(136,136,136)">Tor lurker / </span><span style="color:rgb(136,136,136)">sympathizer</span><span style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"> / advocate, exit node maintainer.</span></i></div>
<div style="font-weight:bold"><font><font color="#888888"><span style="font-weight:normal">Director / Computer Repair Technician @ TechFix LTD [<a href="http://www.techfixuk.com" target="_blank">http://www.techfixuk.com</a>]</span></font></font></div>
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